Sunday, October 17, 2010

Evolution of Internal Energy in Tai Chi (part 3)



The following good questions were originally submitted to the series "The most popular Tai Chi is bad". I think the questions show that some students are taking things to heart and thinking critically about what they read.  The questions also go to the heart of what has been written rather than  personal proclivities, eg., "my style", "their style", etc.  I answer it here because it really goes to the heart of how internal energy evolved.  I have included several quotes from Hwa Laoshi to reference what I say as well. We do not want to ever think that a most popular style with outurned back foot or even the style we practice with parallel feet is the only style or foot positions that a teacher knows or knew (in the case of Lu Chan or anyone else for that matter).  Someone made that mistake about Wu Chien Chuan at the Toronto Wu Family conference in the 90's.  Master Hwa addresses that foible and uses one of my favorite quotes of how "frogs at the bottom of wells should not be croaking to the world how big the sky is".


In regard to "...create a style...only changed who...size of circle...":  I can only defer to what my teacher tells me personally rather than a generic accounting of a family history.  I think generic family histories  are just that, and really shed little historical analysis or in some cases may muddy the water even more. 


In light of how easy it is to paint ourselves into a corner with our assumptions about what styles a teacher knows, we should also not think that "...it cannot be changed..." strictly applies to size of circle or who will be taught. I think that statement about "change"  cannot be fully appreciated unless one understands also puts in the time to understand the true depths of study that they have to plumb themselves. For one, most people want to learn fast. The truth is to learn the form itself takes several years to be proficient. Second, most people want the illusion of self-defense, they also want to learn fast. To test how effective one's martial applications are also takes an additional several years.  Third,  most people believe what the Sunday newspaper tells them about health benefits.  To confirm those allegations about improved health takes a human generation.


Sifu Jim, Referring to the article http://www.wustyle.com/en/db/person.php?cid=9991 the grandsons (Yang Cheng Fu and older brother Yang Shao Hou ) are not mentioned. Is Yang Pan-hou their father? The above article is of course about Master Wu Chan Yau so I understand why they might not be mentioned. Also, regarding parallel feet, per the quote in Master Hwa's book 'that Wu told him tha Wu did not change what they learned from the Yang and insisted that they cannot be changed' ..I'm taking this to mean that Yang Lu-chan practiced with parallel feet. Is this correct? Page 2 of the above article states that Wu Chien Yau "created a style which he called Wu Family Tai Chi Chuan". As stated earlier in the paragraph the only things he changed were whom he would teach and the size of the circle...no mention of feet. Thanks in advance for comments 


This link gives a graphical representation of the Yang Family Tree which is probably easier to follow who is a son and who is a father: 


Yang Family Tree


Lu Chan had 3 sons, Jian Hou, Ban Hou and Feng Hou.  
Jian Hou is Father of Cheng Fu, Zhao Yuan and Shao Hou


Re: "the quote in Master Hwa's book 'that Wu told him tha Wu did not change what they learned from the Yang and insisted that they cannot be changed'...taking this to mean that Yang Lu-chan practiced with parallel feet. Is this correct...


Re:  Page 2 of the above article states that Wu Chien Yau "created a style which he called Wu Family Tai Chi Chuan". As stated earlier in the paragraph the only things he changed were whom he would teach and the size of the circle...no mention of feet..."



  • To deal with these questions, students should call on their own critical thinking and make up their own minds. I use a series of quotations that have been published for several years.  I do this because I think it is important that students read for themselves rather than listen to my commentary. Master Hwa has previously stated the following quotations in the Tai Chi Forums  : 

  • "it is clear that the Wu’s learned Tai Chi from the Yangs’ without any other influence. It also gives you an account about the Yang family and how much they treasured their Tai Chi heritage particularly the small circle or the compact form."

  • Master Hwa has stated that he uses a translation from a Chinese book about the history of the Yang Family. In that book it states: "Yang Shao-hou started serious Tai Chi training with his father when he was seven. His accomplishment could match his father and his uncle Ban-hou. In fact, people think that his temperament very much resembled his uncle. His preference was small circle and liked to use fa-chin to throw people- often his students. Because of his compact movements, impatient to teach the basics, and eager to punish, very few students could take it. It is unfortunate that this highly accomplished Tai Chi Master was not able to pass on his knowledge about Tai Chi.” 

  • Master Hwa has previously stated:  (Someone at a Wu's family conference Toronto 1990's) "...who was taught “large frame” by Wu Chien Chuan when he was teenager, thought that was all Wu knew! If he thought that when he was teenager, its excusable. But now at his old age, with all the published discussion about Wu’s prowess at Compact Form, he still thinks that way. He is truly clueless. Unfortunately, it is this kind of person, who saw a master play one style immediately assume that was that master’s style, or that family’s style, who has muddied the water about the history of tai chi. Prime examples are: "Yang Ban-Hou had other teachers beside his father Yang Lu-Chan and therefore his style is different from his father." “Large frame” or “large circle” is the hallmark of Yang style, ignoring the fact that several Yangs are known for their zeal for compact form such as Yang Shao-hou, brother of Yang Cheng-Fu. This reminds me of a Chinese saying “sitting in the bottom of a well trying to figure out how big is the sky”.

  •  "Translated from a Chinese book about the History of the Yang Family: “Yang Cheng-Fu was not interested in Tai Chi until his father passed away. He then practiced day and night to improve his Tai Chi. Much of it were self-taught based on what he remembered in his younger years. He was a patient teacher and had many students. His style was the large circle which people refer to now as Yang Style."
  •  "... what they did for the camera was not representative of theirstyle. During that era, printed picture in the book have very poor quality (I have several of such books), difficult to see any details. If a pose was in the compact form, it probably showed very little what was going on. Master Wu’s pictures are all in very large frame style. An interesting story as told by one of Wu Chien Chuan’s student was that he asked Wu why one of his tai chi photo had wrong posture. Wu said that the photographer told him to do this way. The story just show that these masters really did not give a hoot about their photographs."Master Hwa has previously said : "...My teacher Young Wabu describing how Master Wu, during sparring, could stick to the opponent keeping opponent constantly out of balance. This is the epitome of tai chi martial art. It is formless; an abstract of all the training he had gone through---leg power from “large cicle”, internal power from “small circle”, movements from form practice, sense and touch developed during push hand and sparring exercise, etc."
























1 comment:

Marty Saposnick said...

Like anything else to be proficient in tai chi the practitioner must put the time in. As a practitioner of over 40 years, I've learned and I am still learning.

With that said if you are interested in learning tai chi as a self defense you must practice push hands with many opponents and then practice sparring with many oponents.

You can not get the feel and practical ability without having the experience of sparring.